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Post by MALCOLM XERXES™ on Mar 21, 2005 11:18:37 GMT
My oh my, this is fascinating. Let me think abou this before I come back AT. Thanks for the work you've put in. nb Strangeways is a UK prison, Manchester I think. “THERE GOES A TENNER” is, to my ears, the funniest of all MS. KATE BUSH’S songs because it evokes imagery from the great EALING STUDIOS™ comedies that starred people like MESSRS. ARTHUR ASKEY, GEORGE FORMBY, et al.
The heist has been planned perfectly, but just as would later happen in DEAD PRESIDENTS™, a surfeit of explosive material destroys the money & renders the entire venture a washout.
I took “That’s when we used to vote for him” to be in reference to the bloke whose physiognomy adorned the 10 shilling note, so that we would know just how long the song’s Protagonist had languished in prison, & that his share had become obsolete while he was doing PORRIDGE™, so his life had been wasted in vain.
The first stanza of “We’re waiting” happens while the joint is being cased in order to ascertain that nobody’s in there, & that no (possibly armed) resistance will be met when the Protagonist & his accomplices proceed with the robbery.
“1 of the rabble needs money/ The government will never find the money” is a verse that I interpreted as the loot being handed off to a bystander, rather than allowing it to fall into the hands of the rozzers who are on their way to arrest the bloke who got rendered unconscious by the blast.
“I’ve been here all day/ A star in a strange way” is reference to the song’s Protagonist being interrogated by the rozzers about the identity of his accomplices & the whereabouts of the loot. (Strangeways Prison is very close to the part of Manchester I’m from, but that is not what the lyric is about!)
POST SCRIPTUM: ADEY, your avatar from the “RUNNING UP THAT HILL” videoclip always makes me wonder what would happen if THE THIN WHITE DUKE & MS. KATE BUSH were to collaborate on a videoclip, as MR. DAVID BOWIE did with LA LA LA HUMAN STEPS™....
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Post by Adey on Mar 21, 2005 11:39:51 GMT
1 of the rabble needs money/ The government will never find the money” is a verse that I interpreted as the loot being handed off to a bystander, rather than allowing it to fall into the hands of the rozzers who are on their way to arrest the bloke who got rendered unconscious by the blast. Quite likely - but isn't the lyric "one of the rabble needs mummy"? That would make the rabble her own gang, and one of them in distress at the turn of events.. [/color][/quote] Yes indeed. The original theatrical rocker meets the next generation version.. (and both schooled in mime by Lindsey Kemp). Bowie's uncanny ability to remain current means that such a collaboration could still be very exciting.
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Post by MALCOLM XERXES™ on Mar 21, 2005 12:23:28 GMT
Quite likely - but isn't the lyric "one of the rabble needs mummy"? That would make the rabble her own gang, and one of them in distress at the turn of events.. Yes indeed. The original theatrical rocker meets the next generation version.. (and both schooled in mime by Lindsey Kemp). Bowie's uncanny ability to remain current means that such a collaboration could still be very exciting. ADEY,
I'm prepared to be corrected about that, but I have never once heard the lyric as "mummy", especially since "rabble" denotes a multitude of people, rather than a mere 4 or 5 gangsters.
Both KEMPsters, eh? I had not known that of MS. KATE BUSH'S work, as well; thanks for the intel. So much of what I have always enjoyed about MR. DAVID BOWIE'S work is the manner in which he moves his body, especially in videoclips like "BOYS KEEP SWINGING" & "FASHION".
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Post by Al Truest on Mar 22, 2005 3:58:24 GMT
Gaffaweb supports both the notion that ''strange ways'' alludes to the prison; as well as one of the rabble needing 'mummy'... scared I parenthetically assume. So you both have good points. Also, MX, I've always found this number to be amusing. The first time I heard the line ''What about Edward G'' I heard it as ''Quarter-pounder with cheese. I must make myself hear it as it was written to this day.
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Post by MALCOLM XERXES™ on Apr 15, 2005 21:33:52 GMT
I just seconds ago finished listening to "THERE GOES A TENNER" on headphones from a streamed source, & I heard for the first time "Strangeways" rather than "strange way".
I do hereby apologise most humbly to all for having made an erroneous assertion, & hope that I did not offend by doing so.
Mea culpa. Mea maxima culpa.
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Scott
Reaching Out
Get out of my house
Posts: 266
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Post by Scott on Apr 16, 2005 1:40:32 GMT
OK REMEMBER OK REMEMBER
....ok, I am SOOOOOOOOO glad to see this pop up. Give me a minute to review. S.
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Scott
Reaching Out
Get out of my house
Posts: 266
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Post by Scott on Apr 17, 2005 2:22:11 GMT
The Woman is a musical genius.... (give me a few more minutes)
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Scott
Reaching Out
Get out of my house
Posts: 266
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Post by Scott on Apr 17, 2005 2:42:41 GMT
Agreed, this line doesn't seem to fit with the (or at least my) ordinary understanding of the song. Anyone?
(said someone)
Doesn't seem to fit?
It fit for Kate. Therefore, it fit.
Face it.
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Post by Al Truest on Apr 17, 2005 17:52:22 GMT
Agreed, this line doesn't seem to fit with the (or at least my) ordinary understanding of the song. Anyone? (said someone) Doesn't seem to fit? It fit for Kate. Therefore, it fit. Face it. I'm not having any issues with it. No need for any apologies either, MX. Either way works for me. Being a 'star' at Strangeways' would imply, though, a sympathy for an apparent anti-government stance. Conversely, have an interrogator shine the 'spotlight' implies that everyone's attention is focused on the noteriety of the culpret. Duality of meaning, as in for example the works of Shakespeare, makes for more complex and meaningful art. Also, Scott - The ''O.K. Remember'' line seems to have dual meaning as well. First, they must all remember to follow their plan. ''We've just half an hour to get in and get out'' and ''Three beeps means trouble's coming'' However, this line could also set the stage for a more meaningful interpretation of the lyrics. Consider that it may set up what is asked in the last line of the song. ''Remember them. We used to vote for him'' I take this last line as a nostalgic wish for better political climate. Portraits on the fivers and tenners represent past political leaders. ''Okay Remember'' sets the stage, i.e., O.K. Remember why we're doing this....This whole robbery could have been to raise money for a cause such as the IRA, as perhaps is also an underlying theme in 'Night of the Swallow' as well.
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Post by brisbanekatefan on Jul 7, 2005 12:25:40 GMT
I know there has been much debate about what is being said in the background after "What's all this then?"
Around the 2:35 mark.
I listened to the song in my earphones full blast and I swear they are saying "A-one and a-two and a-three and a-four and five"
What do you all think?
Maybe I'm just slow and fans have already realised this...
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Post by Adey on Jul 7, 2005 12:31:34 GMT
An unintentional recording of a musician on the track counting time perhaps? And then not noticed at the mixdown?
I don't know, I've never heard it..
(Welcome to the Forum by the way. You are welcome..)
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Post by tannis on Dec 4, 2007 5:32:12 GMT
IMHO... I think they're petty crooks with IRA sympathies (political, anti-UK government). They're an over-enthused outfit, but don't have the gelignite sussed! ... The song is about 'actors' trying to (literally) bust through walls, with the political subtext of a divided/violated Ireland. The black 'Ealing comedy' is great - act like actors; needs mummy; the poetic alliteration; and the way the exasperated protagonist regards himself as a more authentic criminal over the "rabble" (yet the voice-over thinks he's also acting like an actor, E.G.!) ... The protagonist is arrested/questioned/imprisoned. When released, the money is obsolete! The mentioned actors and shilling notes suggest the robbery took place 30/40s (also the band sound, and the cinematic Oh-Oh's and policeman?). So I think the 'remember him' refers to Sir Oswald Mosley (1896-1980): Google: By 1922, Mosley was ready to leave the Conservative Party over its Irish policy which had created the Black and Tans and supported the violent repression of Irish Nationalism. Mosley, of Irish descent himself, sat the next two years as an Independent, eventually joining Labour in 1924... - (If him/Mosley is correct, this brings even more dark humour to the song: In 1932 Mosley met Benito Mussolini in Italy and founded the British Union of Fascists; and in 1936 he married Diana Mitford in Goebbels's drawing room, with Adolf Hitler one of only six guests at the ceremony! ... I guess Mosley forgot his Irish sympathies (and the gang forgot about the gelignite); so the protagonist is ironically remembering wasting votes (and effort) on a political let-down!) - NB. NOTS was an Ireland-only single. EDIT: "We're waiting..." - this could be for the safe to blow; or it could be for political change in Ireland, hence the video swing-o-meter pendulum (thanks Al . "A star in strange ways..." - maybe protagonist became/was a notable inmate; and maybe the IRA were incarcerated at Strangeways Prison? - "The Black and Tan War began in Jan 1919. Within months, the British had captured a number of 'diehard Republicans,' and decided that it would be safer for them to hold those prisoners in England, incarcerated in Strangeways Prison, Manchester..." The prison has a central dodecagonal hall, with wings A to F radiating off from it. So the "A1, A2,..." whisperings could = 'A' Wing cells? "They'll get nothing from me" - interrogation; intelligence about other operations/activists? "Ooh I remember that rich windy weather..." - this could be a childhood/'carry' memory of Southern Ireland/Eire?
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Post by Adey on Dec 5, 2007 13:38:45 GMT
That would make 2 songs from The Dreaming having references to the IRA, as I think Al also observed..
In the case of "There Goes a Tenner", I'm less convinced. No love for that vile organisation from this guy, but I would acknowledge that they always seemed to be competent in their villainy - being commited to their cause and well trained & funded. The implication of "There Goes.." is that this gang were less than professional!
The line "Thats when we used to vote for him" has always bothered me though. It seems incongruous in this song, as if Kate was alluding to something she didn't want to be immediately obvious..
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Post by tannis on Dec 5, 2007 15:52:42 GMT
Yes Adey, I see your point re: 'IRA.' This song is 'historical'; and the events take place long before the outbreak of the Troubles. Maybe these guys are just disaffected lads who turn to crime. But maybe they had been 'voting' against the mainstream UK government to effect democratic change in its stance vis-a-vis Ireland? 1916 saw the Easter Rising and execution of Pearse et al at Kilmainham Gaol (now a great museum!). Then came the 'Old IRA'; the Black and Tans; Michael Collins and the Irish Civil War; Mosley's defection; etc. If him/Mosley is correct, the song ends with the protagonist reflecting on his High Hopes/Great Expectations - his 'democratic' vote for Mosley was just another false hope in his "miserable life"! PS. In the 1930s, the 'anti-treaty IRA' attempted a bombing campaign in Britain in an effort to end partition. The World War II period also saw attempts to gain financial and military support from Nazi Germany and German Intelligence (wiki). EDIT: Ten Shilling Note (1928-1970). So maybe the 'vote for him' refers to Neville Chamblain? 28th May 1937 - Neville Chamberlain succeeds Baldwin as Prime Minister. 29th December 1937 - Irish Free State is abolished, and replaced by sovereign state of Eire. "...Negotiator Chamberlain called his Anglo-Irish bill an "act of faith," admitted he had granted generous terms to Eire to gain her friendship. In Eire it was announced that Neville Chamberlain will spend a fishing holiday this summer in Galway—the first visit of a British Prime Minister to Ireland since 1916" - TIME, Monday, May 16, 1938. 29th September, 1938 - Chamberlain, Adolf Hitler, Edouard Daladier and Benito Mussolini signed the Munich Agreement! We're waiting We're waiting We're waiting...'That's when we used to vote for him' - Note the emphasis on 'him' - I think this line is saying "Remember when we waited for the democratic process to effect change! The politicians didn't listen! ... So now there's the Troubles, the Dirty Protest, Thatcher, Bobby Sands, etc. etc."
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Post by rosabelbelieve on Jan 14, 2008 23:36:18 GMT
This song has a fairly obvious literal meaning, but, in keeping with the idea of a song cycle, this is a more metaphorical interpretation. After the chaotic and energetic beginning of a quest towards enlightenment in SIYL, this song seems to me to show the blunders and mistakes which always accompany any creative or philosophical endeavor. X (our protagonist ) has started out feeling quite courageous and full of energy, but when the time comes to actually begin the action of learning, of working creatively, and confronting oneself and one's unconscious (all possible activities essential to getting anywhere in the philosophical, spiritual and artistic spheres I imagine this quest leading into) she grows anxious and unsure. She is new at this whole process, and though she tries seeing this as a game she "musn't give away" or herself and her "partners"- maybe part of her own psyche - as actors, fear seeps through her nonchalance and results in her making mistakes. Which is natural, of course, and actually quite important. Her journey, in all it's messiness, has really begun- ideas are clumsily becoming visible.
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